The future of flight: discussion and problem solving.

[Logan R]

I am and have been sincere. Claiming that membership is a requirement for communication doesn't demonstrate a willingness on your part to understand or change. 6 pages and nobody has been willing to address the core problems.

[Ben Reese]

Logan, it is as simple as 123..


Here is 1st Msg: "Quoting Fortune Cookie #1"
""BE MINDFUL OF THE WORK OF OTHERS""

All of us, USHPA


Here is 2nd Msg. "Quoting Fortune Cookie #2"
""A HELPING HAND WILL PULL YOU UP THIS WEEK""

All of us posting and advising you, USHPA


Here is 3rd Msg: "Quoting Fortune Cookie #3"
""OPEN YOUR HEART""

Join us, USHPA


You can't make this up Logan.
No one could predict this dialog.
No one would argue with this advice.

Please don't be "no one"..


Ben

[Big Bird]

...nobody has been willing to address the core problems.

You, and thinking everything is someone else's fault...

[Logan R]

Just no. Joining an organization that refuses to address even very simple, solvable problems while demanding blind obedience just isnt in my nature. It certainly isn't freedom.

[DougM]

Just no. Joining an organization that refuses to address even very simple, solvable problems while demanding blind obedience just isnt in my nature. It certainly isn't freedom.

Why am I responding to this stuff???

Anyway, I believe, from all of our perspectives, your understanding of the issues is not fully developed.. You seem to be only seeing your perceived issues that you have experienced at the flying site that you fly. You are not understanding that each site has it's particular set of attributes. And just as Rem has calmly indicated to you over in the HG.org forum, there are many good reasons to have the ushpa rules and site protections in effect even though the ushpa is not as perfect as we all would like.

This free-flight business is not at all free. Quality instruction isn't free. Why would you not want to reimburse John for his valuable time for assessing your skills and providing you with a rating? Would it not be irresponsible to decline to reimburse a pilot , who has more time flying and teaching experience than near anyone else, for their expert time and experience in helping you? What if your place of employment did the same to you?

I really can not understand your unwillingness to acknowledge that to gain any kind of flying skills requires some form of lessons that lead to some form of credentials that are universally accepted. These require someone with experience to assess. Their time is being consumed in the period it takes for them to take assessment. They have also taken the time and long paths to ensure to all of us that they do in fact have the experience to assess others. Why would this be hard for anyone to acknowledge their achievements, and therefore happily reimburse them for their valuable time? You will do the same for any FAA rating. Anyone thinking that free-flight is free from any charges or fees is only fooling themselves.
Merely because the FAA has given us the privileges to fly without an FAA rating system in ultralight craft does not mean that we should not police ourselves. So far the ushpa has done a good job, we have a reliable system to help the bad actors correct themselves, and we have a reasonable record of safety and responsibility, and we continue flight for all of us.

[Logan R]

I actually agree with a majority of what you have said. Especially the bit about respecting time. So why are we stuck on such an inefficient and subjective test method? The (official) requirements are quite simple and straight forward. If we were testing to the official standard a pilot could send in a copy of his flight log, a few go-pro videos, and call it a day. Instead we have to pay an instructor to show up, hope for good weather, and squander that valuable opportunity performing flight cycles instead of enjoying our TIME. I respect time, I just don't respect those that demand I waste mine so that we can perpetuate an inefficient and costly system. Not to mention the pitfalls associated with the raters own self-interest. So absolutely, let us PLEASE respect time.

If you want to use the FAA checkflight method… One would expect FAA professionalism. Besides; a go-pro video does a better job of simulating the check ride.


Also: the instruction that I received from mentors that simply loved sharing their sport was significantly better than what I received from those simply trying to make a living at it… Just my experience.

Also also: "credentials that are universally accepted", USHPA does not have this standing. You are a private club. "Police ourselves" and "Policed by USHPA" are vastly different statements.

[Joe Faust]

John Heiney
http://www.johnheiney.com/

His name came up many times in this topic thread.
May he get the respect he deserves by spelling his name correctly.

======================================================
Form a simpler national org dedicated to recreational hang gliding with robustly enhanced mentorship culture and Internet pilot-log pages for all to review as they wish, but

sans competition events, sans towing, sans managing instruction, sans managing certification, sans PG, sans narrow view of the spectrum of hang gliding activity,
sans ratings and badges, sans events, sans national oversight of local clubs, sans insurance involvement, sans non-FAR 103 vehicles, sans medical examinations, sans badging, sans required tests (create self tests and post on self-regulated pilot pages, if one wants such; hey, my mentors, how do you think I am doing with regard to such and so; post that on one's own pilot page, if one wants such; and have anyone post a written test; take the test and record score on one's pilot page; some written tests will gain favor; some will not win favor), self-declare a rating and give evidence on one's page; have various generic ratings to respect a very wide spectrum of hang gliding participation),

The present big private entity ORG exercises non-American unfair acting on several fronts; such is repugnant to clear-seeing U.S. citizens. That ORG mitigates against transparency, against fair trade, against free-associating, against how our justice system works, against aviation safety, and against the blossoming of focused recreational hang gliding.

Dare to put strong communication coins into revealing the richness of FAR 103, the robustness of the states' recreational-use statutes, the depth of wide disclosure of pilot-profiles via Internet disencrusted from untrustworthy commercial and biased rating systems of a truncated-HG-org culture. Let property owners receive the URLs for each pilot's HG profile using a property, perhaps. Implicit already over parks and public lands is a protection of managers over recreational users uninvited and non-charged. Note that non-nude hikers who jump up in the air, runners who leave the ground are pilots of their clothes wings; they are frequently flying in public parks and on public lands and on private lands. The birds are also using the airspace and lands without having to join a repugnant-acting PG-saturated ORG.

Get involved families and parties to form a class action lawsuit against any entity (person, instructor, club, association) that promotes PG without full and clear disclosure of the PDMC and the sure disaster inroads that natural frequently occurring atmospheric helicities will play over the 0-neg-g high aspect ratio parachutes (PG), 1,728 known fatalities and counting.

Internet pilot-profile pages: pilot could quote mentors' comments; mentors could require fair and truthful quoting. No need to send to any entity video. Pilot could just post video on his or her web page in the national recreation hang gliding space. Self-regulate with quality mentoring! Leave open the full giant spectrum of hang gliding activity, not a narrow commercially-biasing corner of hang gliding.

Delay not. Now is a good time to begin the new era. Stop feeding coin to a PG-ORG to the loss of the legacy and potential of recreational hang gliding. Encourage the formation of the mgf-United States Paragliding Association to handle the Darwinian PG realm; give no more HG energy or coin to the extant PG-saturated org. Just focus on recreational hang gliding. Let "events" care for themselves; the new-era focused recreational hang gliding entity need not involve in "events" where special interests have their play for their reasons.

:36_8_9: flying

[Logan R]

Joe, you rock. My intentions, if poorly communicated, are that; IF we MUST have a rating (despite FAR 103, I still don't understand ignoring FAA rulings) why not make it as simple as possible? More flying, less BS.

[Swift]

Logan, it is as simple as 123..

Here is 1st Msg: "Quoting Fortune Cookie #1"
""BE MINDFUL OF THE WORK OF OTHERS""

Aren't fortune cookie fortunes intended for the guy that eats the nasty things?
If you base your thinking on this kind of hokus pokus then it is you that should be mindful
of Logan's work and not the other way around, Iron Man.

Based on such skewed logic I rescind previous offer for Jantar, again.
The motor glider sounds like a failed project for cheap motor glider.
Great idea if you could really pull it off but evidently didn't work out.
Appears to be a very fragile under powered airplane to me.

[Ben Reese]

Logan, it is as simple as 123..

Here is 1st Msg: "Quoting Fortune Cookie #1"
""BE MINDFUL OF THE WORK OF OTHERS""

Aren't fortune cookie fortunes intended for the guy that eats the nasty things?
If you base your thinking on this kind of hokus pokus then it is you that should be mindful
of Logan's work and not the other way around, Iron Man.

Based on such skewed logic I rescind previous offer for Jantar, again.
The motor glider sounds like a failed project for cheap motor glider.
Great idea if you could really pull it off but evidently didn't work out.
Appears to be a very fragile under powered airplane to me.

""Mindful of Logans work?""

What work is that?

Attempt to break down USHPA…

Attempt to lower standards of performance…

Iron Man, yes I left the suit over at the Org. You miss it don't you..
It still fits just as good as it used to. But it is a blunt tool for people like you.

"Hokus Pokus and Fortune Cookies"… So you can read… Thanks for confirming.
There are several ways to call forth the wisdom hidden in an FC.

Some people share a fortune by each pulling the cookie apart like a wishbone
so the one with majority cookie in hand owns the fortune. But it's still shared..

The Cookiecommunication experiment was real and exactly as I described it.

Sorry you don't beleive..

Here is a quote:
"A civilization Sienticilly advanced enough would appear as if doing magic
to a lesser advanced civilization." I.E. "Hokus Pokus"

It is possible you and I may be this far apart.

Also explains why your idea of value is so much less than mine with
an offer so low for a glider worth so much..

Same as your Ignorant assumption about a motorglider designed to be ultra
efficient "Ecosoar". It is meant to be underpowered and still perform…

It is just like you…
Underpowered and in need of all its ability all the time, otherwise it sits on
the ramp trying to look capable…

Ecosoar is, Something you cannot get data on because their is only one…
So you can't possibly know enough to make a determination.

But you, data is spewing out all over and making itself well known.

The only thing underpowered is displayed in your intellect which
may be raised by proper diet and wholesome exercise and mental
discipline, if you cared to make the effort..

It is posts like this by people like you who slither about in the postings
of the .Org that immigrated me here to the Land of OZ..

Honestly you are part of the furniture around here and if you were gone
you would be Swiftly missed "pun intended".

We benefit from your example as something to aspire above..
A low bar that builds confidence for those who fall so low…

A noble purpose no less valued than mine…


B R